TRADE J.J. OR MISS PLAYOFFS???
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  1. linfieldrunner
    linfieldrunner
    Posts: 7

    Posted 01/20/2013 11:22 AM

    Okay, here's the plain, honest-to-god truth from this morning's Oregonian.

    Olshey admitted that last summer, he had NO IDEA we would be a playoff team, and thus DID NOT SPEND ANY REAL MONEY on our god-awful bench. Of course, he looks like an IDIOT now.

    Watching last night's loss against Milwaukee, I do not see us being a playoff team anymore if we keep the same players. SOMETHING has to change, i.e. at the very least, Nolan Smith should be waived ASAP. This guy has just not proven enough to me either as a PG or SG that he's worth keeping around. I think if he wasn't on the floor at all and Price came in instead during the 1st quarter, we would have won the game. Seriously.

    Getting to the main issue, if we're going to make the playoffs, WE NEED A BETTER BENCH. If Olshey has any brains left (don't even get me STARTED...) he will at least consider making a trade for a proven sixth-man scorer off the bench before the trade deadline in February.

    Here's the thing, though. Clearly the only player we have with any value that isn't in the middle of a contract is J.J. Hickson, and we definitely aren't getting rid of the other starters any time soon. Yes, I know J.J's stats are extremely impressive, and YES, I know he has 23 double-doubles for the season. He's playing extremely well in his role! BUT, I'd wager to say that if he doesn't get traded soon for a sixth-man guy, WE WILL NOT MAKE THE PLAYOFFS. At this point, I'd rather see Meyers and/or Joel start at the 5 and have our bench be much improved.

    With all that said, here's my question for all of you. Should we, in fact, shop around to trade J.J., and if we do, who do we trade him for? Or do we stick it out and settle for not making the playoffs and focusing on next year's team, which Olshey originally had in mind way back when?

    All comments are appreciated.

    Max MIlander '14

      

    I am a fan of BATUM. QUATRE VINGT HUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  1. Nuno
    Nuno
    Posts: 212

    Posted 01/20/2013 1:06 PM

    I agree with most of what you´re saying.

    But we could get 1 or 2 bench players without letting JJ go.

    Just need to let other players go, N. Smith should be one of them.

    And add 1 or 2 guards to really help he team of the bench.

  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/20/2013 2:33 PM

    Barbosa wants out of Boston and is making 800k.  He would be better than anyone on the Blazer bench.  I'm just a fan that tried to follow what little news there is about the Blazers.  I can't understand how a guy with Olshey's resources and access can't get this team 1 or 2 guys that can play well for 15-20 minutes a game.
  1. Nuno
    Nuno
    Posts: 212

    Posted 01/20/2013 2:42 PM

    other thing i cant understand is why, he is keeping a player, like nolan smith that just cant give nothing god to the team...
  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/20/2013 3:03 PM

    I don't like piling on players, but the reality is, Smith has been a liability to put in the game.  Giving him minutes hurts the team.  You could make the same argument for Barton.  Baton is a ball hog, plays out of control, and his shooting isn't good and his free throws are't much better... but I will give him a pass because at least he is a rookie.

     

    I would rather see Jefferies, Pavlovic, Leonard, Freeland, Claver, and Price be the only players allowed to play. 

  1. riverman
    riverman
    Posts: 1431

    Posted 01/20/2013 3:10 PM

    Posted By Blazer Fanatic on 01/20/2013 2:33 PM
    Barbosa wants out of Boston and is making 800k.  He would be better than anyone on the Blazer bench.  I'm just a fan that tried to follow what little news there is about the Blazers.  I can't understand how a guy with Olshey's resources and access can't get this team 1 or 2 guys that can play well for 15-20 minutes a game.

    I agree completely! Barbosa is a steal. I wanted him last summer and when Boston picked him up I thought we missed out. I think Olshey like Stotts and probably most of the front office expected we'd have 3 guys coming off the bench and getting production for 20 minutes but ..well...didn't happen. Could be the front office is so thrilled with Lillard  that they've dropped the ball on the bench weakness. Whatever the reasoning, our bench players are not taking advantage of the opportunities they've been given so far. I'd like to see Olshey address this before the deadline. If we don't see some progress from the bench the locals are going to get out the torches and pitchforks. Not a pretty site at all! If the Wizards sweep us, there'll be panic in Rip City.
    I am a fan of A team that plays like Tower of Power on a big stage on a good night
  1. Nuno
    Nuno
    Posts: 212

    Posted 01/20/2013 3:18 PM

    That´s the way i would go to. i would add Babbit to those.

    but being realistic, we arent going anywhere, if the roster stays like this (unless suddenly they start doing something different then what they did until now)

    i agree that rookies, need time and minutes to develop, but we got from trades Jefries and Pavlovic, to be our 2nd options, when they were 3strings on their teams? both are useful, but dont score much, Price most of the times, doesn deliver what the team need (6th man). and babbit  gets some points, once in a while... e. williams is injured... and smith....

  1. linfieldrunner
    linfieldrunner
    Posts: 7

    Posted 01/20/2013 7:49 PM

    Thanks for the responses.

    Getting Barbosa sounds intriguing! I haven't heard of any character issues or run-ins with the law from him, which I know is what we're trying to avoid. However, GM Ainge has denied the claims that he asked the Celtics office for a trade. Apparently Barbosa hasn't told him first-hand, according to hoopsworld.com, so that would explain it. 

    Nonetheless, Ainge is a smart guy. He's won championship rings both as a player and GM (unfortunately not when he was a Blazer, but that's a different story...) so if in fact Barbosa's demands for a trade are true and he communicates with the front office about it, I'm positive Ainge is going to expect us to give him something good in return.

    Who else but J.J???

    Seriously, there's NO WAY we can just trade two of our bench players for Barbosa. Sorry, NOT HAPPENING. Ainge isn't that dumb. Maybe two of our bench guys IN ADDITION TO J.J! Now that would be some deal!!!

    So how about Nolan Smith, Will Barton or Elliott Williams, and J.J. to Boston for Barbosa? Now that's a DEAL!!! It would benefit both teams, both short- and long-term!!!

    I mean, Barbosa's been struggling with Boston, so let's take a chance with him and hope he blends in better with Rip City over here and starts making shots! All we need is this guy's past numbers with the Suns, and suddenly we can be DANGEROUS come playoff time.

    Yeah Nuno, I guess we were all expecting E. Williams to score some points off the bench, shame he's out for the entire year...AGAIN. Here's the thing, though. We're tied with Houston for 8th in the West. Houston has dropped a bunch but they WILL figure it out with Harden and maybe even Jeremy Lin leading the way, I guarantee it. Dallas is winning again now that Nowitzki is finally healthy. The Lakers, if they ever figure it out, could start winning at any time. It's just too close. That's why we need to pull this off if we have any intention of getting into the playoffs. Love the Barbosa idea.

    At the very least, yes, Olshey NEEDS to waive Nolan and possibly Barton. I'm STILL a huge Coby Karl fan from the preseason, maybe he'll step up if we sign HIM!!! Never understood why he didn't get the 15th spot on the roster and Nolan made the cut instead... 

    And riverman, YOU ARE SPOT ON. If we get swept by Washington after Monday, threads like this are going to be FILLED with complaints in no time. People WILL panic. People WILL start pointing fingers at Olshey for his apparent ignorance. People WILL hurl insults at Stotts for his recent questionable substitutions that LOSE GAMES...if they haven't started doing that already.

    That's why the Barbosa deal, or something similar to it, should be checked into. Just DO NOT give up any of the other starters at all costs, that's all I have to say to our GM, love him or hate him.

    GET COBY KARL BACK!!! I could dream about that all day... 


    I am a fan of BATUM. QUATRE VINGT HUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  1. kenny c.
    kenny c.
    Posts: 418

    Posted 01/21/2013 6:41 AM

    Lets make some trades and get a sixth man, I hope He isn't suggesting this is how this whole season is going to go, awesome starting 5 and lousy bench, that is unacceptable. We can make the playoffs if we make some moves

    It's always "next summer" with this team, that mentality is getting old. Seriously The heat needed a rebounder and they went out and got one in birdman, we need a bench and our GM says wait til next summer, WEAK! That's the difference between winning attitudes and and losing attitudes. This team will continue to Go nowhere until the Ownership and Management have a win at all costs perspective, sadly I don't see the killer instinct in this Organization. 

     

    I am a fan of Winning
  1. The Unholy
    The Unholy
    Posts: 352

    Posted 01/21/2013 8:38 AM

    jj for barbosa? i wouldn't do that straight up, let alone any of our bench players. waiving nolan is useless since his salary will still count against the cap. they might as well keep him so salaries can match in a trade. but back to hickson for barbosa, you people must be out of your minds. trade your starting center and leading rebounder for a struggling shooting guard? if anything the team needs another big man in addition to jj. price is an ok back-up pg. i would focus on a big guy and a 6th man, both of which will be made available in the off season. i would keep jj tho. best BEST case scenario is a starting big and a scoring 2 or 3. that way jj can cause havoc off the bench.

    I am a fan of high octane motion offense
  1. The Unholy
    The Unholy
    Posts: 352

    Posted 01/21/2013 8:49 AM

    and you really can't blame olshey not spending money last offseason. nobody, and i mean nobody knew what we had with our starting lineup. wes had an off year last season and people didn't think batum was going to be able to play up to his contract, not to mention the uncertainty about whether hickson could continue what he started at the end of last year. everything is so simple in retrospect. it's laughably easy to say what olshey could've would've should've done. all in all im just glad he didn't do anything stupid. but i agree that something needs to be done and i sincerely hope it doesn't involve moving jj. correct me if im wrong but i dont even think he can be traded without his permission anyway. something about his one year contract? i mean think about it, jj could've easily gotten a multi-year deal somewhere else but he signed for a year so they could go after hibbert.

    I am a fan of high octane motion offense
  1. linfieldrunner
    linfieldrunner
    Posts: 7

    Posted 01/21/2013 9:05 AM

    It's heating up!!!


    kenny c., I love your stuff in general. Excellent post and I couldn't agree more. That WIN mentality needs to be there from the front office. Not as crazy as Bob Whitsitt was doing it back in the day, but it really needs to be there.


    The Unholy: Getting another big man would certainly improve us short-term, but think about this...if we do in fact get a big man and keep J.J., THEN WHAT DOES THAT SAY TO MEYERS??? It honestly is going to make us look like we picked him in the draft just for the hell of it! I say get him more acclimated to the NBA by giving him more minutes. I truly believe that if we just take this chance with Barbosa and drop J.J's numbers, we will STILL be a better team that can make the playoffs. FYI, I wouldn't be opposed to trading J.J. for a true big man who can score. Just get the rookie center minutes, because he needs them to improve and won't get them with what you're proposing, as much as it would be nice for this year only.


    But again I ask...who would this big man be??? That's really what it comes down to. Can Olshey find a big man with big character by the trading deadline???


    And as for Nolan...I know that waiving him would still count against us in the salary cap. But at the rate we're going, if he's not off this team, Stotts will continue to give him some early minutes and we will continue to lose games in the 1st quarter. It's that simple. 

    I am a fan of BATUM. QUATRE VINGT HUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  1. kenny c.
    kenny c.
    Posts: 418

    Posted 01/21/2013 9:17 AM

    I would most certainly Keep J.J. but I would waive Nolan and get Delonte West, I know he is crazy but I think he can Score, You could run him and price play small and fast. At least sign him to a  10 day and see how it works. I know most will say he is damaged goods, I say exactly he has to redeem himself so see if he does.
    I am a fan of Winning
  1. The Unholy
    The Unholy
    Posts: 352

    Posted 01/21/2013 9:25 AM

    Posted By linfieldrunner on 01/21/2013 9:05 AM

    It's heating up!!!


    The Unholy: Getting another big man would certainly improve us short-term, but think about this...if we do in fact get a big man and keep J.J., THEN WHAT DOES THAT SAY TO MEYERS??? It honestly is going to make us look like we picked him in the draft just for the hell of it! I say get him more acclimated to the NBA by giving him more minutes. I truly believe that if we just take this chance with Barbosa and drop J.J's numbers, we will STILL be a better team that can make the playoffs. FYI, I wouldn't be opposed to trading J.J. for a true big man who can score. Just get the rookie center minutes, because he needs them to improve and won't get them with what you're proposing, as much as it would be nice for this year only.


    But again I ask...who would this big man be??? That's really what it comes down to. Can Olshey find a big man with big character by the trading deadline???


    And as for Nolan...I know that waiving him would still count against us in the salary cap. But at the rate we're going, if he's not off this team, Stotts will continue to give him some early minutes and we will continue to lose games in the 1st quarter. It's that simple. 

    myers needs to learn from a big man. things like post defense and shot blocking and defending the pick n roll. these aren't necessarily things jj does well so it would be best to put another big in the rotation. if they had a starting C myers could still get time alongside jj off the bench while also watching and learning from whoever played center. but i see your point about myers losing out on some minutes, but it wouldn't be an awful lot. he's going to take awhile to mature anyway, look how long it took jermaine o'neal.


    I am a fan of high octane motion offense
  1. Siccolo
    Siccolo
    Posts: 1250

    Posted 01/21/2013 10:35 AM

    Who cares if Myers doesnt get minutes, he doesnt do anything anyways. What about Freeland he wouldnt get mintues if we signed a big...


    But I dont think it would take Hickson to get Barbosa. It shouldnt take much since Boston already has Terry, Lee, Bradley, Rondo, 

    Maybe they take Price and a second rounder..... 

    I am a fan of This Quote "One Love. One Heart. One Human race."
  1. linfieldrunner
    linfieldrunner
    Posts: 7

    Posted 01/21/2013 10:55 AM

    Siccolo and The Unholy: Both of you are off. Just off by a little bit.


    First off, Siccolo, you can't just dismiss that Meyers "doesn't do anything anyways." (note the punctuation!) He's a rookie, let me remind you, and a decent pick for No. 11 in the draft. Rookie big men do take a while to develop. Minutes on the floor will make them better. Be patient and let him grow. 


    FYI, that's what we DID NOT DO with Jermaine O'Neal, by the way. If Whitsitt had brains (and he had even less than Olshey does right now) he wouldn't have been IMPATIENT with his growth and traded him away for Dale Davis. That has to be one of the WORST trades in franchise history, IF NOT THE WORST. I'M STILL FLAMING MAD ABOUT IT!!! Just making another point there, not saying The Unholy was wrong for saying that.


    Freeland, who already played a bunch in England and is older by a significant-enough margin, is a different story! He's around the age where most big centers hit their peak, and I would argue that Leonard has shown much more promise than Freeland with the minutes he's gotten thus far. Actually, GASP, that's why he was getting more minutes than Joel before he got injured!!! IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE!!!


    And Siccolo, did you read the first part of this thread? Ainge is a smart GM for Boston. There is no way I can believe he will accept Price and a second rounder for Barbosa. It's just not that attractive of an offer, the way I see it. This guy has championship rings as a player and GM. No way he's biting on that.


    If we are indeed going to use The Unholy's idea, we might as well trade Freeland for a big guy who can score. I wouldn't mind that, either. That's a good point.


    Another thing...I posted the same initial prompt on my blog and got a response. A guy named Travis suggested we try to get Randy Foye and/or Gordon Hayward. Any thoughts on that?


    Also, if anyone's looking to get more specifics on Olshey's comments from yesterday, check out Blazerfanatic's blog post called, "The truth will set you free, but won't win you games." That's a FANTASTIC POST and completely reinforces what I'm trying to say.



     

    I am a fan of BATUM. QUATRE VINGT HUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  1. Avgjoe28
    Avgjoe28
    Posts: 55

    Posted 01/21/2013 11:03 AM

     Ok a couple things one JJ has to approve a trade do to his bird rights. i don't see him going any where because of that. Two to not give Myeres minutes would be a mistake the kid is only like 19 or 20 to say he cant do anything i think is jumping the gun. Three I think there are some players in the D league that could give us more points and better production that some of our bench i.e. Chris Johnson would make a better back up 4 than any back 4 we have, then we could move babbit to the back up 3 have barton play back up 2 until elliot comes back, and keep ronnie at back up 1 at least until we get a better back up PG.

    If i were GM i would move JJ to the bench he could still play 30 mins a night but stat myeres. Hickson could be the number one option off the bench, and the way LA has been rebounding it would be ok. We need JJs production to stay the same but if he could come in behind lamarcus then when LA comes in let jj play for Lenord and so on. just my thought. I know Myeres is Raw but I dont think he is as much of liability as some may think. I think if given more mins to get in the stride of the game those mistakes he makes will start to go down and you will get more production from him.

    I am a fan of
  1. Siccolo
    Siccolo
    Posts: 1250

    Posted 01/21/2013 11:40 AM

    Yeah the Barbosa deal wasnt really thought out, my bad.

    Drafting Myers Leonard with the 11th pick was not a good choice.

    They were better players picked after the 11th pick (Henson, Zeller, Sullinger, Nicholsan, even Lamb or TJones)

    We also could have traded the pick to move up or to gather assets. A lot of young 7 footers we could have gotten for a cheaper price.

    I would love to get Foye or Hayward.

    I dont know about the Hickson situation. I mean if we can get a great deal our of him like a couple quality bench players or a big man that can score. But if we cant find a good deal for him, we should just sign him to decent contract then have him as a piece for our future.

    I am a fan of This Quote "One Love. One Heart. One Human race."
  1. riverman
    riverman
    Posts: 1431

    Posted 01/21/2013 11:48 AM

    You don't trade JJ Hickson for a bench player that makes 800k a season. What's the point of that? I see us resigning JJ to a long contract in the offseason. Barbosa is an affordable stop gap scorer who can contribute to a fast breaking bench. He's the perfect guy to spell Wes and Nic. Meyers is a keeper but a project. A 7ft center who can run and make free throws is a solid long term investment. I'd like to keep our starters with Freeland, Barton and Claver at the bottom of the bench and upgrade from there. Sign Barbosa and send Smith to Idaho and bring in Karl. Use the cap flexibility to make a run at Redick to get a 6 man. Redick and Barbosa would be a punch off the bench. Fill in the blank with an affordable big rebounding defender that clogs the lanes and we could do some playoff damage. To get a Pekovic type center would break the bank and eliminate the cap space to go after a 6th man. I also think Minnesota matches any Pek offers. Unless a team settles for a Turiaf, Dalembert, O'Neil type, I'd look at bringing back the Rhino from Israel and letting him spell JJ and LA.
    I am a fan of A team that plays like Tower of Power on a big stage on a good night
  1. The Unholy
    The Unholy
    Posts: 352

    Posted 01/21/2013 12:00 PM

    yeah the jermaine o'neal thing was more of an example of how long it takes a big to mature, not saying trade myers. i meant that with the right players around him to mold his game after he would mature faster than getting minutes on his own, but actually to play him alongside said players. wasn't sure if i made that clear or not. thing is, out of all the players that could be traded i would rather trade wes than hickson, who gets rebounds and is the starting center, (for now), but all wes does is knock down 3s and he's pretty streaky at that. i know people are going to come after me for suggesting this but a shooting guard is much easier to come by in the nba.

    I am a fan of high octane motion offense
  1. linfieldrunner
    linfieldrunner
    Posts: 7

    Posted 01/21/2013 1:01 PM

    Avgjoe28: Thanks for all of that. Much appreciated.


    Siccolo: I guess we'll agree to disagree on picking Meyers in the draft. The point is, we have him now, so let's see what we can get out of him.


    riverman: I LOVE YOUR THINKING!!! That's an interesting idea you've got there. I would, however, like to see the Smith-Karl exchange happen ASAP, and that should be doable for Olshey.


    The Unholy: Spot on. I understood where you were coming from with that. As for trading Wes...get back to me on that. I have to think it over...


    Great discussion!

    I am a fan of BATUM. QUATRE VINGT HUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  1. BLASER
    BLASER
    Posts: 757

    Posted 01/21/2013 1:10 PM

    Posted By Siccolo on 01/21/2013 10:35 AM

    Who cares if Myers doesnt get minutes, he doesnt do anything anyways. What about Freeland he wouldnt get mintues if we signed a big...


    But I dont think it would take Hickson to get Barbosa. It shouldnt take much since Boston already has Terry, Lee, Bradley, Rondo, 

    Maybe they take Price and a second rounder..... 


    name a center outside of howard that has exploded on the scene there rookie years? nobody in the top 5 let alone the top 10 of c's outside of howard had big rookie years they all took time to develop 

    I am a fan of defensive man beasts
  1. Siccolo
    Siccolo
    Posts: 1250

    Posted 01/21/2013 3:06 PM

    This is a good discussion lol

    I agree were kinda stuck with Leonard hahahah

    Im way too hard on Myers- Hopefully he will help me change my thoughts



    The Unholy- This is what I was also thinking....... Wes just brings that heart and D that I love. But his offensive game is not really appealing. That is why we should find a really good offensive minded SG to have a- Harden- Sefolosha,  Brewer- Jr Smith,  Green-Ginobli,  Willie Green- Crawford


    The thing about going after JJ Redick is that we already have a lot of 3 point shooters. I would like to bring in someone that can handle the ball and bring that can also attack the rim. Nick Young, Barbosa, Randy Foye, Redick would be nice but his game is pretty 1 dimensional from what Ive seen.


    I mean there was a lot of centers that came in to the league and made a impact right when they entered. Many brought Scoring, Rebounding, Blocking shots, smart plays, Defense 

    Roy Hibbert, Al Horford, Tyler Zeller, Andre Drummond, Lopez

    I am a fan of This Quote "One Love. One Heart. One Human race."
  1. DHawes22
    DHawes22
    Posts: 6488

    Posted 01/21/2013 3:55 PM

    You can't blame Olshey. If anyone is being honest, we all thought this team was a 30-35 win team, MAX. No one knew Damian was going to be this good. No one could have predicted JJ to become this double-double machine. And Batum took a lot of people by surprise by playing a much more all-around game. Of course Olshey bolsters the bench last summer if he knew all of this, but he didn't and neither did we. Now we must go into each game with the guys we've got and hope for the best. We still have cap room to spend this summer as well.
    I am a fan of
  1. BlazerManiac
    BlazerManiac
    Posts: 777

    Posted 01/21/2013 5:10 PM

     

    Hopefully all the minutes the startes are playing will not lead to injuries.

    I am a fan of WES, the heart and soul of the Blazers.
  1. Siccolo
    Siccolo
    Posts: 1250

    Posted 01/21/2013 5:19 PM

    But why did he give us THIS BAD of a bench?? lololololo

    I am a fan of This Quote "One Love. One Heart. One Human race."
  1. Nuno
    Nuno
    Posts: 212

    Posted 01/21/2013 5:42 PM

    maybe the worst bench of all, we have lots of potential in the bench, but none that does  what we need right now.
  1. BDawg
    BDawg
    Posts: 1593

    Posted 01/21/2013 5:54 PM

    Insanity is often defined as doing the same thing in the same manner, yet expecting a different result (see '12/'13 Blazer bench)

    I am a fan of players that play with PASSION and PRIDE
  1. Travis
    Travis
    Posts: 4

    Posted 01/21/2013 6:15 PM

    I would like seeing Randy Foye or Gordon Hayward and a draft pick. However, I would not mind seeing Barbosa coming off the bench for Portland. I would like to get more than one player for a J.J. trade. No matter what happens we need to change the bench. First, by waiving Nolan Smith and trading J.J. However, some may say that we should keep J.J. but as a fan that brings me fear because if he keeps playing this great, there is the possibility that he will ask for a bigger contract. Do we want to offer him a big contract? Any ideas? 
  1. Travis
    Travis
    Posts: 4

    Posted 01/21/2013 6:18 PM

    I recently was talking to a friend and he brought of the thought of trading J.J. for Jordan Crawford...any ideas?

  1. linfieldrunner
    linfieldrunner
    Posts: 7

    Posted 01/21/2013 6:36 PM

    Wait...JORDAN Crawford??? As long as that's his name and not JAMAL Crawford (he had his chance last year...), well...I guess I haven't thought about that long enough yet. Get back to me on that, Travis. And thanks for posting on here! 


    Excellent discussion all around and I never thought I would get this many responses. This is great!!! 


    I think I'll leave it up to the rest of you to narrow down the list of worthy candidates. I'm a little slow on knowing all that compared to some of you, haha. But thanks so much!

    I am a fan of BATUM. QUATRE VINGT HUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/21/2013 8:34 PM

    Posted By The Unholy on 01/21/2013 8:38 AM

    jj for barbosa? i wouldn't do that straight up, let alone any of our bench players. waiving nolan is useless since his salary will still count against the cap. they might as well keep him so salaries can match in a trade. but back to hickson for barbosa, you people must be out of your minds. trade your starting center and leading rebounder for a struggling shooting guard? if anything the team needs another big man in addition to jj. price is an ok back-up pg. i would focus on a big guy and a 6th man, both of which will be made available in the off season. i would keep jj tho. best BEST case scenario is a starting big and a scoring 2 or 3. that way jj can cause havoc off the bench.

    WHOOOW WHOOOW  WHOOOW... take it easy?!?!?!  Who is saying that?  Barbosa for Hickson?  lol  

     

    From a realistic standpoint:  Hickson makes $4 mil, Barbosa makes $860k.  Even if you wanted to, which is really out of the box thinking in a bad way, you couldn't because their contracts don't match, AND Boston is already over the cap.  Portland got Pavlovic to help Boston facilitate a trade.  Blazers took on his cap, but Boston is paying his salary because they were over the cap.  In fact, a straight up trade for Babbitt for Barbosa doesn't work, because Babbitt's salary is more than 125% +100k than Barbosa (unless Boston recieved a trade exception)

     

    I do blame Olshey for not spending money on a real asset like Mayo.  I do blame Olshey for not knowing more than what I knew.  But my critisism is not without some understanding, that noone could have predicted being 20-15 to start the season. 

  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/21/2013 8:40 PM

    Posted By linfieldrunner on 01/21/2013 9:05 AM .

    But again I ask...who would this big man be??? That's really what it comes down to. Can Olshey find a big man with big character by the trading deadline???

    And as for Nolan...I know that waiving him would still count against us in the salary cap. But at the rate we're going, if he's not off this team, Stotts will continue to give him some early minutes and we will continue to lose games in the 1st quarter. It's that simple. 


    Chris Kaman, Nikola Pekovic, Robin Lopez, Timofy Mozgov, Tiago Splitter, Zaza Pachulia...  I don't believe Olshey can find a big man before the trade dead line, any more than I believe Hickson would even agree to a trade (as he has the option to veto).  What I'm talking about, and others, is a shooting guards like Barbosa.  A guy who does not involve moving any of the starting 5.

    Trading Nolan would be my choice, for a legit back up that could give 15+ decent minutes per game.  The other team would do so to gain cap flexibility, as Nolan comes off their books at season's end.

  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/21/2013 8:42 PM

    Posted By Avgjoe28 on 01/21/2013 11:03 AM

      Chris Johnson would make a better back up 4 than any back 4 we have.

    He was picked up my Minnesota.  He's playing well for them.

  1. cmeese47
    cmeese47
    Posts: 2735

    Posted 01/21/2013 10:51 PM


    Posted By DHawes22 on 01/21/2013 3:55 PM
    You can't blame Olshey. If anyone is being honest, we all thought this team was a 30-35 win team, MAX. No one knew Damian was going to be this good. No one could have predicted JJ to become this double-double machine. And Batum took a lot of people by surprise by playing a much more all-around game. Of course Olshey bolsters the bench last summer if he knew all of this, but he didn't and neither did we. Now we must go into each game with the guys we've got and hope for the best. We still have cap room to spend this summer as well.



    That is bs Dustin you in fact have to blame Olshey for the exact reasons you said. Wesley was coming off a down year, Lillard was an unknown rookie and Batum had a new huge contract to try and earn. For those reasons alone Olshey should have known that we needed a bench in case Wes continued to struggle or Lillard or Batum disappointed. Those three have largely been very good and now without a bench our team is screwed and we have no assets outside our starters to trade. No one can say that Babbitt, Smith, Claver, Williams, Or Freeland are worth more than they would have been this summer. We lost trade value and no Olshey is in a terrible spot either trade devalued assets or hold pat and look like your giving up on the season.

    Barbosa should be acquired he should only cost a second round pick and should take Nolan's spot. We can eat his salary without sending anyone back to Boston and the Celtics probably would appreciate the trade exception even if it is a small one.
    I am a fan of Getting Defensive Players This Summer.
  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/22/2013 1:56 AM

    We're on the same page cmeese.  Not to dwell on the past, but what can Olshey do now moving forward?  I refuse to accept there isn't a Jeremy Lin out there with at least HALF of his ability somewhere in the D-League, or rotting on someone else's bench that wants out now and would welcome a move to Portland.  No disrespect to Nolan as a person, but his game is not adiquate for NBA play with Portland.
  1. BDawg
    BDawg
    Posts: 1593

    Posted 01/22/2013 5:03 AM

    If Paul Allen a shrewd businessman....I make under six figures, obviously far less than does Olshea.  Not to add to the dog pile on Neil...but I was the one who first mentioned both Leandro Barbosa and Chris Johnson, Barbosa MONTHS ago.  I'll work for 100K Paul.  Just sayin'..


    Ridiculous...right?  This is the frustration here in a nutshell.  Prevailing thought is that noone of importance within the organization reads anything on the boards.  Maybe they should.

    I am a fan of players that play with PASSION and PRIDE
  1. Siccolo
    Siccolo
    Posts: 1250

    Posted 01/22/2013 11:44 AM

    Very good point Cmeese

    I also agree with BlazerFanatic there HAS to be someone in the D League that is better than Nolan Smith/Price

    The best prospects according to the D League are : Shelvin Mack (Who is top 10 player in the world) hes a PG that used to play for the Wizards.

    Courney Fordson who is a PG that is BEASTING in the D League he is 5'11 tho


    Jerome Jordan is the third on the prospect list. This guys is really good imo

    I am a fan of This Quote "One Love. One Heart. One Human race."
  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/22/2013 3:12 PM

    Posted By BDawg on 01/22/2013 5:03 AM

    If Paul Allen a shrewd businessman....I make under six figures, obviously far less than does Olshea.  Not to add to the dog pile on Neil...but I was the one who first mentioned both Leandro Barbosa and Chris Johnson, Barbosa MONTHS ago.  I'll work for 100K Paul.  Just sayin'..

    Ridiculous...right?  This is the frustration here in a nutshell.  Prevailing thought is that noone of importance within the organization reads anything on the boards.  Maybe they should.


    Nother personal, but the rookie minimum is only 860k.  Would you still play if you don't quite make $1 mil? 

     

    And I always wanted to ask you.  Do you type Olshea as a slight, or are you accidentally mispelling his name?  Is a "y" in Olshey not an "a".

  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/22/2013 3:13 PM

    oh... oops, that's the vets min... rookie min is like half that... $460k. 
  1. BDawg
    BDawg
    Posts: 1593

    Posted 01/22/2013 6:17 PM

    Posted By Blazer Fanatic on 01/22/2013 3:12 PM
    Posted By BDawg on 01/22/2013 5:03 AM

    If Paul Allen a shrewd businessman....I make under six figures, obviously far less than does Olshea.  Not to add to the dog pile on Neil...but I was the one who first mentioned both Leandro Barbosa and Chris Johnson, Barbosa MONTHS ago.  I'll work for 100K Paul.  Just sayin'..

     

    Ridiculous...right?  This is the frustration here in a nutshell.  Prevailing thought is that noone of importance within the organization reads anything on the boards.  Maybe they should.

    Nother personal, but the rookie minimum is only 860k.  Would you still play if you don't quite make $1 mil? 

     

    And I always wanted to ask you.  Do you type Olshea as a slight, or are you accidentally mispelling his name?  Is a "y" in Olshey not an "a".

     

     

    Beginning a post in which you address a misspelling by another fan in their post, with a misspelling of your own is almost too phunny.  I fear you misunderstood the position I felt I was qualified to apply for as well.  I wasn't referring to a player, but rather the acting GM, Neil OlsheY's position.  Certainly my abilities to assess talent, value, and fit are at the very least, on par with those of Mr. OlsheY...and I'm a bargain at 100K.  My playing days are in the rear-view...lol. 



    I am a fan of players that play with PASSION and PRIDE
  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/22/2013 7:10 PM

    Posted By BDawg on 01/22/2013 6:17 PM
    Posted By Blazer Fanatic on 01/22/2013 3:12 PM
    Posted By BDawg on 01/22/2013 5:03 AM

    If Paul Allen a shrewd businessman....I make under six figures, obviously far less than does Olshea.  Not to add to the dog pile on Neil...but I was the one who first mentioned both Leandro Barbosa and Chris Johnson, Barbosa MONTHS ago.  I'll work for 100K Paul.  Just sayin'..

     

    Ridiculous...right?  This is the frustration here in a nutshell.  Prevailing thought is that noone of importance within the organization reads anything on the boards.  Maybe they should.

    Nother personal, but the rookie minimum is only 860k.  Would you still play if you don't quite make $1 mil? 

     

    And I always wanted to ask you.  Do you type Olshea as a slight, or are you accidentally mispelling his name?  Is a "y" in Olshey not an "a".

     

     

    Beginning a post in which you address a misspelling by another fan in their post, with a misspelling of your own is almost too phunny.  I fear you misunderstood the position I felt I was qualified to apply for as well.  I wasn't referring to a player, but rather the acting GM, Neil OlsheY's position.  Certainly my abilities to assess talent, value, and fit are at the very least, on par with those of Mr. OlsheY...and I'm a bargain at 100K.  My playing days are in the rear-view...lol. 





    My point was jokingly that you could play better than the bench, but that you would get the rookie minimum of half a mil, not $1 mil.  And was asking if you would be ok playing for that salary?  Technically speaking, I address the misspelling last.  My orthography is terrible.  I'm a poor speller.  I probably should have sent a private message to ask.  I wasn't bustin your brass, I was honestly inquiring if you did not like Olshey and were purposefully misspelling his name, as I have seen you spell his name "Olshea" many times  Olshea sounds like a woman, and I didn't know if you were making fun of him, or if it was just an honest mistake.  As poor as my orthography is, I don't make a habit of misspelling Blazer player, coach, and management's names.  I assumed you were doing it purposefull out of distain for Olshey, so I was just asking.

    In short, that feeling or reaction doesn't mean a fan is fair whether. It could in fact mean they are an extremely passionate fan who is very competative and hates losing.

  1. Blazer Fanatic
    Blazer Fanatic
    Posts: 758

    Posted 01/22/2013 7:12 PM

    In short, that feeling or reaction doesn't mean a fan is fair whether. It could in fact mean they are an extremely passionate fan who is very competative and hates losing.  oops! lol  disregaurd.  fail
  1. sedare
    sedare
    Posts: 53

    Posted 01/22/2013 9:59 PM

    BF already touched on this... Boston hugely over cap this year, so IF they part with Barbosa, he will be a steal... but like linfield said... Ainge is no retard.


    I liked Karl in Preseason... and was shocked he didnt make the roster. He moved very well away from the ball, and created energy... and had a 3pt shot to boot.


    If you think Meyers isnt getting play time... look at his fouls/injuries. He was in foul trouble most of the game last night, and at some point its a close game... back to the starters.


    The Blazers simply need to keep their head in a game long enough to either put a team away in the 3rd quarter with the proclaimed "Best starting 5 in the league" by a few... or in reality, a very good starting 5 that should be able to control a game with any other 5 in the game. But they just have over inflated stats because they play so many minutes, just like LA has over inflated stats at Center when Blazers play way small vs VERY small teams. 


    In all honesty I want to see them demolish a team in the first 24 minutes, (or get absolutely completely and utterly blown to smithereens)... so I can see this bench get decent minutes vs a real opposing team. They just dont play enough for ANY OF US FANS to get a TRUE feel for the talent that MIGHT lay below our starters. I cant blame anyone for this... because at least in the last 10 games now, they have remained a factor (losing but w/e) in all 10 games... ending the game with less then 6 points difference. After all this is a franchise record. Most consecutive games with less then 6 points deciding the outcome no matter of win/loss. This has got to be hurting our starters durability. 


    Another thing. Because of all these close game scenarios, Stotts is forced to play inconsistant minutes to players in small incriments to get a little playtime to everyone this season when this was supposed to be a period of development for the 5 rookies this team has on its roster. Was this amount of hope anticipated for the Blazers to make the playoffs? NOT AT ALL. This has been stated a number of times by Olshey in the past, that his was a rebuild that would TAKE TIME. Given, based on these last 10 games, we have come a long way, and now we are forced to try and test the talent we have during this "rebuild" phase, and lose these close games. But what about later?


    10 Games left in season, 2 games out of 8th place, we only have a small idea of what Barton can become because he never got the chance to get comfortable on the floor... compared to someone that needed 2 years to FINALLY get decent (Babbitt). What about Elliot? I would LOVE to see what he can do, injury has STOLEN this potential from Blazer fans yet again. How about Claver? The more time he has gotten... the more comfortable he has become. Imagine if he rarely gets to play, and we enter the offseason with no true compass for these players.


    How the hell are we going to filter this bench using *WHATEVERCRITERIATHECOACHESANDMANAGEMENTISUSING* if they never have the chance to play because they are not allowed the playing time they 1. Expected 2. Need 3. Now... have not been granted due to possible playoff contention.


    This is nothing we can influence unless someone reads these boards. I would love it if they did, but I will not hold my breath for that...ever.


    All I can hope for is that whatever change DOES take place... we were able to see it coming.


    I always like feeling smart. :)

    I am a fan of standing by the team in my home town, Portland.
  1. Blazerfan7s
    Blazerfan7s
    Posts: 12

    Posted 01/22/2013 10:11 PM

    In my opinion, Babbit, smith, pavlovic, and clavar all have to go. Babbit isn't doing anything from behind the arc, and even when he does his classic pump fake to create a wide open shot he can't hit it. Nolan smith ENOUGH SAID. I know sasha is free and everything, but he hasn't done anything this season either. As for Clavar I really don't care if he is a rookie. I would rather have rudy fernandez than this guy any day. I feel like when Jefferies is on the court he makes the team better. He provides solid defense, and always seems to do the right thing like a veteran should. I'm not ready to write off Leonard yet. He is a rookie and played pretty well coming off an injury against the wizards. Also, Joel Freeland shows a lot of potential as well, and has been showing a lot of energy when he is in the game. Freeland is always battling over the boards. Jefferies should be getting more minutes coming off the bench instead of Babbit eating up all the bench minutes. I think trying to trade JJ is playing with fire. If he decides to veto the trade he might decide to screw us over by not resigning with us in the off season because me might feel disrespected by the trade attempt. Boston is playing horrible right now and are desperate to make some changes. They already have a lot of shooting guards, so we might be able to steal barbosa from boston. Other than that, there aren't really that many other options. The only way we would get a solid bench player (other than barbosa) is to trade jj, which is unrealistic to me. If I was Olshey, I would try and make a small move for 1 or 2 decent bench players, and if he doesn't make a trade so be it. I'm fine with riding out the rest of the season with what we have, and when the off season comes resign JJ, unload the bench, and work on spending that cap space on some nice role players. 

  1. CarlJ1
    CarlJ1
    Posts: 399

    Posted 01/23/2013 1:51 AM

    @ sedare I agree about Coby Karl I don't know why we passed on him he showed me a lot more than Price and Smith but, I guess since Price knew Lillard personally and is a Vet and they wanted to give Nolan another shot that's probably the reason they passed on him I felt Coby handled ball pressure, got us in our sets quicker and is a better shooter than Price and Nolan Blazers made a mistake with that.

     

    @ Blazerfa7s I agree with cutting everyone you mention except Claver I think he will be better than Rudy just for the fact that he's not Rudy and from what I seen from him he can be a good all around player coming of the bench he just needs time to adjust to the game like most European players do it's usually takes a year  same goes for Freeland.

     

    As for JJ If the right deal came along I wouldn't be mad if the Blazers pulled the trigger but, I can't say I would be against having him back as a back up PF that the only way I would want him back because as much as he has played with his whole heart and soul, I just can't stand seeing opposing team kill us in the paint over and over and I'm sorry as much as I love JJ play getting someone to defend the paint would be my first priority. Of course seeing that JJ has the bird rights clause really put this organization in a tough spot but, they have to make a decision because you can't have this guy walk especially when there a possibility to get something in return it may not be major but, it's better that coming up empty handed I guess we'll wait and see and if he does feel disrespect that's his problem because last time I checked this is a business and it up to him to be a professional because it not like the Blazers came up to him and said were not gonna trade you, this is the life he choose and he know trades come with it.

     

     

     

     

    I am a fan of Respect, Loyalty, Honor & Pride the same thing the Blazer & their true fans are made of RIP CITY STAND UP!
  1. DHawes22
    DHawes22
    Posts: 6488

    Posted 01/23/2013 12:41 PM

    Posted By Travis Blair on 01/21/2013 6:18 PM

    I recently was talking to a friend and he brought of the thought of trading J.J. for Jordan Crawford...any ideas?


    A 23-yeard old double-double machine for a chucker at shooting guard? Pass.
    I am a fan of
  1. knorton181
    knorton181
    Posts: 264

    Posted 01/23/2013 12:56 PM

    Claver? You mean cut a rookie?? No.

    As for Karl, we have him in our D-League, at WORST, next season I am sure we bring him up if needed. But then again, isn't Price here for another year? Still not a great backup line to Lillard.

    Olshey in probably his exact words about JJ right now: "Look guys, I mean in a perfect world we would keep JJ and Lamarcus, but when you have a guy like LA, that's where you brought the franchise up around, that's where my choice lies. And if JJ can understand that and wants to be on this team, understanding his role, then of course we would keep him, he is a great player to have. But we're also bringing up Meyers and going to look at other choices to play and the Center position. I think it's pretty obvious that's where we need the most help within our starting group."

    YET, as shown in the article: http://www.blazersedge.com/2013/1/21/3900972/quick-blazers-gm-neil-olshey-wants-playoff-push-and-3-really-good . Olshey clearly states he would much rather give up a 1st rnd draft pick for the chance at a playoff push rather than not make the playoffs. Does that mean he'd give up JJ in order to do that?

     

    Maybe.. But I'd bet we trade this year's pick if we could get Tyreke, or someone of that caliber. We'd probably even throw in another pick, too, and possibly not trade JJ.

    But realistically, so much is up in the air right now. If we were to trade JJ (& maybe this year's pick).. We would have to recieve a decent enough of a Center AND a bench piece, seems like a lot. It would be a big trade, that's for sure.

    I am a fan of
  1. BlazerManiac
    BlazerManiac
    Posts: 777

    Posted 01/23/2013 4:20 PM

    Posted By DHawes22 on 01/23/2013 12:41 PM
    Posted By Travis Blair on 01/21/2013 6:18 PM

    I recently was talking to a friend and he brought of the thought of trading J.J. for Jordan Crawford...any ideas?


    A 23-yeard old double-double machine for a chucker at shooting guard? Pass.


    BIG PASS
    I am a fan of WES, the heart and soul of the Blazers.
  1. commontongue
    commontongue
    Posts: 1864

    Posted 01/25/2013 6:54 PM

    Lowry. Toronto doesnt want him. I'll give you Price,Nolan,Claver and Freeland for Lowry and Ross.
    I am a fan of our new roster playing with and for eachother.
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